Συζήτηση χρήστη:Yasnodark/Αρχείο

Ukraine-Greece question[επεξεργασία κώδικα]

Hello NikosLikomitros, unfortunately, lately your country has openly sided with the aggressor. Initially, at the NATO summit in Vilnius, Greece and Cyprus were 2 out of 7 of the 31 countries that blocked Ukraine's invitation to NATO, a country that fighting alone on the battlefield for European values! They did not invite the country that as early as 1954 as the Ukrainian SSR first submitted an application to NATO, a country whose military has already participated in all military and peacekeeping operations of NATO for 30 years, unlike many member countries, in particular in Bosnia, Kosovo, North Macedonia, Iraq and Afghanistan, and our peacekeepers never ran away, like the Dutch, paving the way for genocide. In 2008, Ukraine did not receive the MAP again, and now there is a new polite refusal with puppetry about an open door with an impassable thug on face control. The Ukrainian army is undoubtedly the strongest in Europe and only because Ukraine voluntarily gave up all its nuclear weapons and strategic aircraft and missiles to Russia at the request of the West, it found itself almost defenseless. Now, with our own missiles from our own planes, "democratic" Russia is shelling our peaceful cities every day, destroying thousands of our schools, hundreds of health care facilities, cultural facilities, religious institutions, and killing civilians and soldiers, who were only yesterday's ballet dancers. opera singers, cinematographers and athletes. The invitation was not given due to non-compliance, although only 9 NATO member countries have better compliance with the organization's standards. As for corruption, we know very well that in Greece and Cyprus it is more likely than in Ukraine than vice versa. I'm not talking about authoritarian mafia Hungary or Germany smeared for 20 years with Russian money, and the last country was ready to be invited if the other 6 countries agree.

More than 10 days ago, Russia, which previously killed millions of Ukrainians with numerous artificial Holodomors, withdrew from the grain initiative to now starve the whole world and destroy the economy of Ukraine, a country that feeds 400 million people in the world. Immediately after Ukraine's statement on the continuation of grain delivery via the Black Sea without Russian illegitimate control, the Kremlin, fearing the consequences for attacking peaceful ships with grain every night for more than 10 days, began mass attacks on all Ukrainian ports on the Black Sea and the Danube, hundreds of drones and missiles flew in the direction of Odessa and Mykolaiv and other Ukrainian ports. The historical and cultural center of Odesa, which is part of the UNESCO heritage, the largest cathedral of the Ukrainian Church of the Moscow Patriarchate was partially destroyed, while the leaders of this diocese were the biggest supporters of Moscow even in their very pro-Russian church, now they call the actions of the Russian Federation genocide, destroyed port terminals and warehouses with hundreds of thousands of tons of grain, oil and other agricultural products, etc. Mykolaiv, which had been bombed daily and nightly for a whole year, suffered no less losses.--Yasnodark (συζήτηση) 12:48, 28 Ιουλίου 2023 (UTC)[απάντηση]

Hello. Happy to hear you are safe. Personally, I think that it's still not the time for Ukraine to join NATO. Maybe after the war, but I dont thinki it's right for now because Russia will take it as an indication of direct conflict with NATO, and things will become worse. For now I am okay with a faster integration to EU, but not NATO. I think that the problems of the counteroffensive also make NATO very cautious with Ukraine.

In Odessa, that is surely a crime, the grain must go. But I disagree how it is distributed; most of it go to Europe rather than Africa which is the victim of imperialist conflicts, whatever if they are conducted/sponsored by Russia/NATO/whatever. Russia is conducting war crimes, I never dispute this, and it's too bad that this loss has happened. For the sake of Great Russian chauvinism, which drains Russia from significant resources. Ukraine has lost its soldiers, Russia too, Russia and Ukraine both lost countless professionals who left (Ukrainian refugees and Russian emigres).

Regarding the Church, I think that both churches should coexist, rather than UOC (M) is prosecuted because it has an affiliation with Moscow although it never disputed the integrity of Ukraine. But this is a disaster for Odessa, definitely. I believe that Russia wants to open the road for the eventual invasion of Odessa and does this.

I feel pity for the deaths of athletes. That is a loss, both Ukraine and Russia have great athletes.

What I believe is that Russians, if they are at least neutral of this, should be allowed to participate in the Olympics. I don't think it's right to exclude Russia from everything, at least don't exclude those who don't agree with the invasion. Keep a door to democratic Russians (not Z patriots who repeat Z propaganda) open. Many oppose the invasion. I don't agree with the invasion, but think Russophobia goes too high. Why Tolstoy to be discouraged in Europe? I am sure he would oppose the invasion.

In Greece, we are mixed. Others support Russia, others like me are neutral and read both pro Ukraine and pro Russian sources to have a complete view but fully oppose Putin, others support Ukraine.

Also by October it seems that Ukrainian Wikipedia will lead the pageviews in Ukraine, something that I wait for. NikosLikomitros (συζήτηση) 14:17, 28 Ιουλίου 2023 (UTC)[απάντηση]

NikosLikomitros Thanks for the detailed reply but I don't know why you think I'm safe https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0C90OB4fzzg , the explosions last night were very loud. We have only three regions that are more or less safe: Zakarpattia and Chernivtsi Oblasts due to the mountains and proximity to the border, and Kyiv Oblast due to the Patriot system protection. I was regretfully upset by a whole bunch of frank statements of Russian propaganda in your answer, and before refuting them, I would like to ask you exactly which Ukrainian and Russian sources you use and in what language? Because there is not a single mass media left in Russia, there are only sources of thoroughly controlled lying propaganda, even a handful of emigrant mass media are just a failed attempt to be neutral, but at least they can be read. By mixing Ukrainian news with Russian news, you do not get the real picture, but only mix relative truth with outright lies, water from a spring with water from a puddle, so in the absence of immunity to exceptionally masterful propaganda, I do not advise you to do this. So I ask you to give links to your sources, and also tell me what languages you speak, in particular, for the perception of audio and video information, and do you have the option of subtitles in a language you know on YouTube?--Yasnodark (συζήτηση) 14:45, 29 Ιουλίου 2023 (UTC)[απάντηση]

@Yasnodark It's good to know you're alive, that's what I mean. Personally I read a huge mix of sources, from RT (yes, the're copies for EU) to Unian, when it comes to UA/RU media, and in Greece I will take my read in all media, from those which are staunchly pro-Ukraine to those that support Russia (we have both), in order to see what Russian propaganda and what Ukrainian government says.

From in.gr, which has a Ukrainian-Greek correspondent (Kostas Onishenko) and of course sides with Ukraine to media like Efsyn where you can see many articles about Ukraine Nazis (here an example of an article joking Bandera). But, as I believe that Bandera or Azov is Nazi (that thoughts were developed before Putin decided to invade Ukraine), same I believe that Bucha and Holodomor was Russia's fault, and Holodomor was a mix of rapid industrialisation and government plans to alter the demography of Ukraine/Ukrainian nation, as my understanding of Holodomor is (e.g. it's too suspicious when loss of many Ukrainians was also in Kazakhstan, so, plans to decrease number of Ukrainians is also a reason for me), because we saw large changes in Kuban and other Ukrainian speaking areas east of UkSSR.

So, as I try to be neutral reading news from both sources (it is very important when you want to learn about a war, and as a history student, I know it very well), I won't descend to Greater Russian nationalism and thus will never believe claims such as Ukraine = 404, or Ukraine = Malorussia, but I won't believe that Bandera is a hero of Ukraine, because he was a Nazi collaborator.

You may disagree with me for Bandera and Azov, but Azov was always called neo-Nazi organisation in the Greek (and foreign) media, at least until 24.2.2022, and today most Greeks consider it Nazi. Of course, if I was Putin, I would never have invaded Ukraine for Bandera and Azov (to say differently, these are not reasons to invade a country), or for any other reason, although I strongly disagree with their ideology, and I don't like that Bandera is a hero for many. The latter, because of my anti-Nazist feelings.

This is a general belief of the most Greeks, regarding Azov. I always admire how Ukraine has fought to be an independent country, all these months, and your patriotism. So, I fully understand you. NikosLikomitros (συζήτηση) 23:11, 29 Ιουλίου 2023 (UTC)[απάντηση]

NikosLikomitros I didn`t know how to respond to a whole bunch of theses of Russian propaganda from the previous paragraph, as you issued another batch of theses of Lifenews, whose propagandists have now disguised themselves as RT. You don't take into account the fact that during Bandera's time Ukraine was occupied by Poland and Russia and his main goal was to gain independence, this is not clear to a person from a country that almost never lost its independence. You talk about imperialists, and it was the troops of those countries who liberated you from the Nazis back in the days of their empire, and you did not see the horrors of the brutal Soviet "liberation", which you managed to avoid. The World War began when not all Ukrainians knew about the millions of Ukrainians killed by the Russians during famines and repressions, on the contrary, the Nazis had not yet committed the main crimes and even in Hitler's homeland only thousands of local residents died and Ukrainians did not know anything bad from Germany, on the contrary, all Ukrainians remembered were wonderful Germans of the 1918 model, the vassalage of Skoropadskyi's country was simply a paradise compared to the horror of the Stalinist regime, and at a time when Stalin was killing Ukrainians with hunger and repression, the only world leader who sank ships with Ukrainian grain taken from dying Ukrainians because of it the peasant was a fascist Mussolini with words like that his country will not eat from the hands of murderers the food taken from the murdered. Also, don't forget that the full name of the Nazi party is the National Socialist Party, and these two aspirations for social justice from socialism and the rights of the Ukrainian nation to a unique life, language and culture, were the long-standing aspirations of Ukrainians. And it is in this context that one should consider the position of many stateless enslaved peoples - Ukrainians, as well as Croats or Slovaks or Lithuanians, Estonians or Latvians, although they suffered much less from the enslavers. They were not supporters of Nazism in the sense of 1945 and did not really see the differences between Germany in 1918 and 1939 and remembered the intelligence of the Germans as the most cultured nation and the atrocities of the Russians and Jews. The latter, although innocent as a nation as a whole, were the main leaders of the repressions in Ukraine, in addition to the fact that simple Jewish merchants bought up the centuries-old family fortunes and shrines of Ukrainians for nothing, and they were forced to do this in order not to die of hunger, so those who the survivor lost everything thanks to the Jews, that's what happened and that was the reality. It should not be forgotten that the same was the role of the Jews during the time of Serfdom and the enslavement of Ukrainians by Russians and Poles in previous centuries, when a Ukrainian was a slave or a pauper, a Jew could buy a Ukrainian in the same way as a colonizer or peel off the last skin in another case. I am simply stating the facts: for years and centuries, Ukrainians and Jews lived side by side, and on the one hand, Ukrainians very often used the services of Jews or jointly participated in the struggle or cultural life, and at the same time, there were always among the Jews those who profited from the troubles of Ukrainians, and among the affected Ukrainians who could use fire and sword to carry rage and revenge for dead or wounded relatives, but there were always many more Ukrainians who tried to save innocent Jews from that rage. What has never been and is not the case in Russia with its staggering level of true Nazism, anti-Semitism, racism and xenophobia. Therefore, it is not surprising that some people liked even this part of the views of the worst among the occupiers, but for the majority of others, the arrival of the Germans was a real liberation from oppression and repression. The collaborators are the French people who accepted the neighboring Germans almost universally knowing their views perfectly well and seeing and hearing Jews and fugitive intellectuals, but accepting the occupation from politicians to marshals and from artists to politicians, for 4 years France fought on the side of Hitler and only to a small handful of de Gaulle's resistance and struggle in the first 40 days and the last year of the war, they are considered the winners from the anti-Hitler coalition, instead, the Ukrainians, who lost 10 million lives at the hands of the Nazis, are considered collaborators, although the French were not threatened with extinction, and the Ukrainians fought for survival in any way. There were 5 Ukrainian fronts with the majority of Ukrainians in them and a significant share in the Belarusian ones, but you will not find a Russian front, even during Stalingrad on the side of the Germans there were a million Russians on the side of the USSR, maybe as many Ukrainians, in the Soviet army Russians were the majority only in the North and fought with the same incompetent meat assaults as now, in other military formations the Russians were primarily only punishers from the NKVD or firing squads, it was the Russians who committed war crimes in these units and during the liberation of the northern territories of the Warsaw Pact countries. However, even those Ukrainians who did not accept Soviet power in any way understood almost immediately the difference between the old Germans of the late 1910s and the new Germans of the early 1940s, Bandera immediately after the arrival of the Germans began the process of creating an independent Ukrainian state and was arrested together with his biggest associates. he, according to your words, was a collaborator in the German concentration camp Sachsenhausen for almost the entire war, and his brothers died in concentration camps, Ukrainian nationalists like Olzhych and Teliga died in the women's ravines together with the Jews, and the Ukrainian resistance to Nazism with the UN and UPA became the largest non-state movement of resistance to Nazism in the world and only the intrigues of the USSR prevented the development of lend-lease for the UPA, as the talks went. The Nuremberg Tribunal denied the crimes of the UPA and did not find them guilty of the crimes of the Nazis, but due to the fact that before that Ukraine was recognized as a country of resistance to the Ukrainian SSR, it was the Soviet military units that received military aid and retained control over Ukraine for several more decades. At the same time, resistance to the UPA continued until the early 1960s. And the resistance was strong, for example, in 1946, my grandfather lost his leg in battles with the UPA on the territory of Poland. Unfortunately, Greece does not understand what, although it was the Russians who deported the Greeks from the Crimea and since then they have not changed at all. So Bandera had a number of negative traits, and in many ways independence did not happen due to his authoritarian leadership, but he was not a Nazi, he was not a collaborator in the sense that you understand, he was not a Judeophobe and he was not a tool of the Nazis. he was an authoritarian ideological leader who tried to choose independence thanks to a situational union, although he contributed little to the struggle during World War II because he was a prisoner in a concentration camp. Bulba-Borovets was a much better leader, but it was the actions of the UPA leadership that did not allow the broad masses to see the advantages of the democratic struggle and this made it possible to gain support for the "liberation" forces of the Soviet forces of the Ukrainian fronts, who were replaced by executioners, rapists, and Chekists. By the way, on the territory of occupied Ukraine, almost half of the Gestapo consisted of former members of the party and the NKVD, who engaged in repressions and seemed to be a well-known bribed underground, so the OUN and UPA became the main driving force of resistance to the Nazi invaders. Contrary to the theses of Russian propaganda.

Not the only valid argument to call "Azov" the "Nazis?" is their symbol, however, runic symbols have been characteristic of the coats of arms of Ukrainian cities and old prints since BC, because the Aryans ruled here for 300 years before coming to Germany, and even our coat of arms Trident on the football player's T-shirts were mistaken for the Nazi symbol by Spanish communists and his career was ruined. Even the swastika is full in the ancient history of Ukraine, of course, because of the use of the Nazis, almost no one uses this symbol, except neo-Nazis. Of course, due to the fact that there were many right-wing and football fans in "Azov" at the beginning of its creation, and there were also Nazis in the direct ideological sense, but these were individual Ukrainian patriots and the main reason for their acceptance was the desire to fight with modern Nazis from Russia, but even in the far-right party "Azov", which has very little in common with the unit of the National Guard, "Azov", Nazism was never an ideology, but was only a "freak" of individual non-influential members. In addition, Russia specially sent its agents as anti-Putins, who were later revealed by the Nazis as Korotkikh. However, the ideology of the party was and is Ukrainian nationalism and the pillars of Ukrainian statehood, as for the "Azov" unit, it is simply a subservient unit of volunteer patriots, mostly unrelated to the party of the same name. Among the dead Azov residents are many athletes, including at least 3 world champions. Azov has nothing to do with Nazism, judging who is a Nazi and who is not should be based on deeds and not on patches. The core of the Nazis is the Wagner Communist Party led by the Nazi Utkin and another executioner Prigozhyn, and in general the Russian army, which shoots for the Ukrainian language or just like that, rapes and tortures people, Azov has never and never committed war crimes, on the other hand, Russia already has about 50 thousands of registered war crimes alone, and all elderly people who survived both occupations say that the Germans were better than the Russians.

NikosLikomitros You write that many Russians are against the war and in particular athletes, but this is an outright fake from Kremlin agents in the West, because according to all opinion polls, both the official office of the Public Opinion Fund and the independent Levada Center, whose founder is one of the few oppositionists Gudkov , as well as the Ukrainian sociological services, which conducted a telephone survey randomly in Russian and using Russian terminology, and in all surveys among all strata of the population, supporters of aggression prevail, only among young people the numbers are approximately equal and only according to separate indirect data in separate surveys. As I already told you, 90 percent of Russian athletes belong to the army or power structures, and even opposition athletes like Lasitskene did not leave them and did not throw away their epaulettes after the start of the war or even a large-scale invasion, 90 percent of non-power athletes also support the war. In theaters and other cultural institutions, with the mandatory support of the SVO, units from each team were released to stay at the workplace. Most people who do not support the war are not ethnic Russians. These are mainly people with Ukrainian, Jewish, Tatar, Georgian or other roots, of the few thousand Russians who protested against the war and the few hundred famous people, only 10th are ethnic Russians. Among several hundred well-known opponents of the war, only a few did not give up their views and did not join the propaganda under pressure, on the other hand, 10,000 well-known Russians are propagandists or supporters of the war. when your mass media say they don't support the war, let them cite specific names or specific polls to prove it, because it's a fake. 39 percent of Russians have relatives in Ukraine, but even famous Ukrainians could not convince their closest and most intelligent people that we do not have Nazis and we do not need to be "liberated". Zombification is total, it was described by the Strugatskyi in the book "Inhabited Island" 54 years.--Yasnodark (συζήτηση) 13:57, 5 Αυγούστου 2023 (UTC)[απάντηση]

NikosLikomitros Another fake of Russian propaganda that the grain flows to the imperialists and not to the poor countries. Firstly, this is not true, secondly, the grain always goes somewhere, thirdly, it is not important because because rich countries buy grain from Ukraine, other countries sell grain not to them, but to poor countries in Africa and Asia. And it is Russia's blockade and bombing of Ukrainian ports and elevators, contrary to all conventions, that increases grain prices and creates famine--Yasnodark (συζήτηση) 13:57, 5 Αυγούστου 2023 (UTC)[απάντηση]

NikosLikomitros The situation with Tolstoy is complicated. On the one hand, two of his great-grandfathers were Ukrainians, one of whom was the last hetman of Ukraine, he knew the Ukrainian language, was against its prohibitions, liked to sing Ukrainian songs and periodically lived in his estates in Ukraine and Kyiv in particular. He was, so to speak, a "good Russian" of that time and was not accepted by the majority because of such views among ordinary Russians. Instead, he wrote about the Russian reality with wars and balls, suicides and other gloomy aspects of Russian life. However, modern Ukrainians do not see that Tolstoy, but Tolstoy, who is used for propaganda of modern Russia, which he beat, surely, as it seems, Tolstoy would not have accepted in the same way. But this is not at all evident from the fact that one of the most odious Russian politicians and propagandists of the war is his direct descendant with the same face, which makes it doubtful possible views of Tolstoy and combines Tolstoy from the propagandists and Tolstoy the propagandist into one, and unfortunately no one is interested in who the real Tolstoy was 100 years ago and how he treated the homeland of his ancestors - Ukraine. Because now both Tolstoys are playing on the side of Russian propaganda. That is why, from the point of view of many Ukrainians, it is inappropriate to believe that Tolstoy has nothing to do with the war in Ukraine, because Russia uses him as a weapon and his great-great-grandson, who is very similar to him, also promotes the war.--Yasnodark (συζήτηση) 13:57, 5 Αυγούστου 2023 (UTC)[απάντηση]

That is why, from the point of view of many Ukrainians, it is inappropriate to believe that Tolstoy has nothing to do with the war in Ukraine, because Russia uses him as a weapon and his great-great-grandson, who is very similar to him, also promotes the war. Therefore, not everything is so simple. I will continue.--Yasnodark (συζήτηση) 13:57, 5 Αυγούστου 2023 (UTC)[απάντηση]

However, you didn't answer my question about language skills? Because RT is a source that should be used as a last resort. You won't hear anything from them except lies

Above I gave you a number of sources mostly in English that you can trust, but I will transfer them here---Yasnodark (συζήτηση) 13:57, 5 Αυγούστου 2023 (UTC)[απάντηση]

NikosLikomitros, would you mind creating an article about the most famous Ukrainian magazine NV and the most comprehensive

https://english.nv.ua/ !!!!!

of those socio-political publications that have an English-language version of "The New Voice of Ukraine" https://twitter.com/NewVoiceUkraine?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Eauthor ?.

I suggest you read this article by en:Judy Dempsey on https://carnegieeurope.eu/strategiceurope

You may also be interested in articles and thoughts :

https://www.ukrainianworldcongress.org/ukraine-war-insights-by-austrian-military-analyst-tom-cooper/

Peter Dickinson

https://www.atlanticcouncil.org/expert/peter-dickinson/

Here are a few List of foreign agents in Russia good Russians who do not support the war.

good Russians channels:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bH9PE9jGKZY

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kamoil6ifrI

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ix4HmxG0UvU

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NAFSE4HHN1Q

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HPJp_AyY1KE

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y1Sr64NH0Jw

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jKLSLTMu_Ao

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xpyiPtuZORA

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4msfB95YR0s

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lmF_CLzfDkg

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DCnBJIkjuok

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AAV7yPTHjyA

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=95O_E1P-X1U

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WeqxjDMzVPA

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q7Q3XoLp-nY

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vma8LssklZU

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC1cWyMNLEPDmnJqd6WQaqEA

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ob4adBd1cng

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H293RUQp5ag

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mob6O8_e5Fs

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3eLl43XIukQ

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8VsYT1vGuuc

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2EtZxUDWVsA

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NKXk5aGedGI

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=53dmfuoQxIY Ukrainian Russian-language channel

.--Yasnodark (συζήτηση) 13:57, 5 Αυγούστου 2023 (UTC)[απάντηση]

Thank you for your time. Your post was pretty interesting, I will make my full response very soon (below are only some points) and I will check your sources.

About my language skills, I know English very well and learn Russian among others. RT is consulted by me to see what Kremlin's point is, just to study the opinion of both countries. But I will study these sources more as well.

Ukraine has some Nazis, but Russia, France, Germany, has too, Greece has too. Approximately the same percent, very low. This is not reason to invade. So it is zombification to believe that Ukrainians are Banderites/Nazis and Russia will liberate Ukraine because there is no Ukrainian nation. Although I understand why it's said, I don't agree with some calling the Russians Orcs or subhumans (some more radical voices, a small minority).

By the way, can you give me a source about Germans were better than Russians? I've heard the story of a Jew that survived the Holocaust but was killed from a Russian blast in Kharkiv, but I would like to learn more, that's very interesting.

Regarding Greeks and Crimea, I know well. They haven't even apologised. But many Greeks have good opinion for Russia and its culture (including me, but I fully disagree with government, Z, Putin and so forth as many culturally Russophile Greeks too thus positive for Russia as country but full disagree and dislike with Putin/Z/Russian government) because of Orthodoxy, and the fact that they helped us through battle of Adrianople to get independence. But for Orthodoxy, we also like Ukraine, and trust me; the war has resulted in Greek people learning about the beautiful country of Ukraine. Even in Greece popularity of Putin plunges. When I saw that there is war, I couldn't believe Russia would do this. I despise the Russian government, although like Russia, it's places and culture. I just try to get the viewpoint of both countries, and I see often a huge difference.

NikosLikomitros (συζήτηση) 15:03, 5 Αυγούστου 2023 (UTC)[απάντηση]

NikosLikomitros Many times in the news, our elderly people said that the Germans were better. But these plots are difficult to find, if there is something similar during another crime - I will try to find it right away.

It is very unfortunate that Greece and Greeks are captured by illusions about the present and future of Russia of its history of culture and society. Russia has always been a barbaric totalitarian country with a rabbial people and the invading imperial harassment with claims for world domination, which, unfortunately, was very facilitated in the past and Ukrainians. It is Russia that is the empire in its essence, which still deprives the identity of dozens of indigenous and small nations colonically attached territories. And not Spain, Portugal, Germany, Belgium, the Netherlands France or Britain or other countries of the West that almost lost the colonial heritage. Only China, Iran, Myanmar and the US have some similar features of empire.

The problem is that everything that was created by the "Russians" of the past, was often made by Ukrainians, as well as Belarusians, Balticts, Jews, and residents of the Caucasus, or assimilated foreigners. Actually, the Russians have created atrocities for thousands of years:

en:Sack of Kiev (1169)

en:Sack of Baturyn

en:Згін населення з Правобережної України в Лівобережну (1711—1712)

uk:Куренівська трагедія

They are ethnically not Slavs, but the Finno-Eels with the impurities of the Mongols, which only after the occupation of Ukraine in the 18th century began to study the literary Ukrainian language, which is now called Russian, and Ukrainians had to make spoken language literary as well, and only partially joined Orthodoxy after the violent transfer of our church from Kyiv to Moscow. The current Russian church is not right-handed, but rather Satanic in its rituals and was created by Stalin in the 1940s and no clergyman of that church could avoid cooperation with the KGB and a large part of the so-called ROC priests were the KGB staff, and later It also applies to today's ROC and its branch in Ukraine and the heads of both churches in particular Cyril. Russia has appropriated the history of Ukraine-Rus after attempting Ukrainians to transfer Ukrainian cultural life to the territory of modern Russia after the Ukrainians of the 17th-18th centuries, it all ended deplorable for Ukrainians. And darkness, on the contrary, absorbed Ukraine. That is why you often think about Russia well and remember some Ukrainians who are considered by Russians or feats of Ukrainians or other nations assigned to Russians or by Ukrainians through the blood of Ukrainians. Most of the victories of the Russian Empire and the USSR were obtained by Ukrainian soldiers. In 1918, most of the Black Sea ships and the Baltic and Pacific fleets were raised by Ukrainian flags. Unfortunately then, Ukrainians were very often fought with each other, and before that they dissolved the army, just as our strategic weapons were surrendered in 1990. History teaches us little.

They are called orcs because they are such barbarians that you cannot imagine, you know Russian culture created by representatives of other nations, but most ethnic Russians, unlike foreigners like you, are not familiar with it. Russians have always respected the primitive in culture, and great artists known abroad were mostly persecuted by Russians during their lifetime and only after their death were they considered great in the Motherland. This culture is often appropriated and rarely culturally mastered by the Russians themselves, it is only a product for export, as well as Orthodoxy, because in Russia there are less than 10 percent Orthodox, moreover, in Ukraine, which is many times smaller, there are more faithful and parishioners of this church than in the whole of Russia, although and we have a significant part of atheists, agnostics, Catholics, Protestants, and Muslims, etc. The Russia you imagine never really existed: There is Moscow, Petersburg and several other cities that are close to these canons, and everything else is a country of darkness and poverty with people who will not lead the whole world and have no relation to cultural life, the exception is a handful of "freaks", and among them there are extremely rarely ethnic Russians and only a little less of those who consider themselves Russian, although many of them simply do not know their thirsty roots from other nations. Zet-Russia is a normal state for Russian society, democracy has never taken root there, try to name democratic figures from Russia? and it will be even more difficult for you to name the periods of democratic order in Russia. Ukraine, on the other hand, has been essentially democratic since ancient times. Unfortunately, the Russians burned the vast majority of our books, and older history cannot be recovered, so you can read about those times only in Herodotus. Maybe later I will ask him to quote you.

For example, with whom do you associate Russia? Name these persons.

Regarding languages: do you perceive audio information in Russian?

In the meantime you have not yet studied Russian then find books or at least articles by Timothy D. Snyder, Serhii Plokhii, Anne Applebaum, Boris Reitschuster, Robert Conquest, James Mace,Mark Solonin, Viktor Suvorov, Garry Kasparov about Ukraine and Central and East Europe in general...--Yasnodark (συζήτηση) 13:46, 6 Αυγούστου 2023 (UTC)[απάντηση]

The country's best fencing hall in Mykolaiv was among the hundreds of sports facilities destroyed by Russia, it was the home hall of Olha Kharlan, a multiple world and European champion, champion of the Universiade and European Fencing Games, Olympic champion of Beijing and three-time medalist of other games in London and Rio, included in the World Fencing Halls of Fame. In addition to hundreds of sports facilities, since February 18, 2014, Russia has already killed about 400 athletes and sports figures, of which, since February 24, 2022, more than 350, including several outstanding coaches, 11 world champions, dozens of world and European championship medalists, about 150 champions of Ukraine. In these difficult conditions, the NOC of Ukraine allowed to compete with "neutral Russians" and warned the International Fencing Federation under the wing of Putin's wallet oligarch Usmanov that there will be no handshakes with murderers, because more than 90 percent of Russian athletes are members of the security forces and officers of the army of murderers or frankly support aggression in Ukraine. After the victory over the pseudo-neutral Russian, Olha Kharlan gave the Russian woman the permitted kovid salute with a saber, and refused and filed a protest, due to which the Ukrainian champion was removed from the competition for disrespecting Russian shit, although she did not show it and the head of the federation from Greece the day before gave Olha her word that he agrees not shaking hands, instead he convened a backroom meeting before the fight and removed the point about exchanging greetings with sabers. Kharlan, because of a knife in the back from corrupt blood money, the Greek was disqualified for 60 days, and only one exclusion from the championship reduces Ukraine - one of the leaders of the world ranking in women's saber, to get to the Olympics in Paris, where Russia was not invited. Kharlan is the best athlete in the women's saber of the last 15 years, Smyrnova is a well-known supporter of the war in Ukraine. However, your representative did everything to destroy Coubertin's Olympic halo "Oh, sport is peace."

https://twitter.com/Ukrsportbase/status/1684536347279720450
https://www.foxsports.com.au/more-sports/fencing-ukrainian-olga-kharlan-disqualified-after-refusing-to-shake-russian-rival-anna-smirnovas-hand/news-story/1aaf3a3121563510868cd13e1a554ee6
https://www.euronews.com/2023/07/27/ukrainian-fencer-olga-kharlan-disqualified-after-refusing-to-shake-her-opponents-hand - I would like to note that usually Euronews is a distributor of Russian fakes and it is presented neutrally
https://www.nbcsports.com/olympics/news/ukraine-russia-olympics-neutral-athletes
https://eng.obozrevatel.com/section-sport/news-photo-of-russian-fencers-denunciation-of-harlan-at-the-2023-world-cup-has-surfaced-27-07-2023.html

NikosLikomitros, So, are the Greeks and you and your social circle going to protest against the destruction of Orthodox churches and culture and sports in Ukraine, against the ban on Greece and Cyprus joining NATO and later the EU, and against your head of the International Fencing Federation Emmanuel Katsiadakis, who destroyed with his cynical mean decision and Failure to keep the word of the noble goal of sport by supporting the provocation of the aggressors?

Because I hope very much that there are people in Greece who do not agree with your leadership of the country and the Greek leader of international fencing. At the very least, I would like to know if these events I described were discussed in the Greek mass media and in social networks? I hope that you, at your level and in your circle of communication, will raise these questions...--Yasnodark (συζήτηση) 12:48, 28 Ιουλίου 2023 (UTC)[απάντηση]